Hey, What Are You Working On?
- Interview by Sawa
- Published:
- In Features
Sawa: I’ve been listening to your podcast, Hey, What Are You Working On? since the very first episode. It’s a great resource for artists, while also being fun to listen to you shoot the shit, and talk about, well, what you’re working on. How did this begin?
Andrea: Originally we started this podcast as a way to help our younger selves. We thought we could make a podcast that covers all the stuff that no one is talking about, which is really the money aspect of art. How you’re running a business, how to build a website, how to do all of the things that your art professors didn’t give you any fucking information about, and make that available.
Devon: One of the biggest themes that comes up for us is building up your art community, building up your resources, making art friends, getting a group together where you can get and give advice. I think a lot of people live in areas where they don’t have access to an art community, so it’s that dose of art friendship that people might be needing which they don’t have IRL.
Marisa: I like how you said IRL, because the whole point of the podcast is reality. We’re talking about the reality of our art worlds and practice. The things we have come up against and how we’ve gotten through them. I think people really come to us for that dose of reality that other people don’t necessarily want to share, which is the good andthe bad.
Andrea: A lot of times when you see an interview it’s all about the achievements and it kind of gives you that sort of Instagram gloss on everything. I think our point is reinforcing that your favorite artists behind the scenes are dealing with difficult things. They’re probably not as rich as you think they are. They’ve struggled a lot more than you think they have. And so being able to talk about how to overcome those challenges is the most important aspect of what we do.
Sawa: It’s also helpful that you cover specific pointers, like how to start a newsletter, how to write an artist bio, etc.
Devon: We talk about how to price your work, how to approach a gallery. We talk about how to navigate being stuck in the creative process. We talk about how to balance life, work, and motherhood.
Marisa: We have different types of episodes, like these resource episodes where listeners can actually find out how to ship stuff and print labels and what not. But we also have ones like, “How do I feel?”
Andrea: And really getting to know what kind of artist you are.
Devon: There’s an episode where we just talk about astrology. And others where we’re just catching up with each other and talking about what’s going on with us.
We try to do a lot of dismantling of the status quo in the art world and why that may or may not be helpful. We do a lot of looking at what’s been the norm here, why is that? What do we think about it? Do we need to subscribe to this anymore? Is it beneficial? And maybe we add some of our own resistances and thoughts to it. We try to be honest about that when we’re recording, and hopefully it shares something relatable to people.
Sawa: I think art should be accessible and relatable. I’m wondering if you’ve found a connection with your art practice, being a good way of processing things or as a good form of therapy.
Andrea: There’s actually a study that shows that when you are involved in an activity that requires considerable problem solving, your body cannot feel pain. It essentially shuts down the limbic system because you’re focusing so hard. The physical act of making art, trying to play a song on the guitar, surfing, all these things where you’re so locked in and focused, the emotional turmoil you feel is dulled. For me as a child, art has always been my safe place. It’s always been a coping mechanism.
Devon: I didn’t go to art school. The reason I started making art, which was a little later in life, was as a way to cope with severe depression. I’ve always leaned on it since then as a way to navigate my mental health issues. And my work itself is largely about processing trauma and revisiting the past.The act of making art is therapeutic for anybody who does it, regardless of what your work is about.
“If you can’t imagine a safe and beautiful world and escape into the possibility of that, you can’t get through all the darkness.”
Sawa: I’m always interested in the fact that our art is something that will live on after we are gone.
Marisa: Right? Art making has always been a part of my existence, and evidence that I’ve been here, evidence of what I’ve experienced and what I’ve gone through. Every piece that I make is tied to my identity and how I’m understanding myself and what I come from, and the vision I have for the world that I want to be in. To have that aim is very grounding, even if I’m living in a fantasy land while I make it. It’s almost, I don’t wanna call it religious, but it’s a ritual. If I don’t have art, I feel like my feet aren’t firmly on the ground.
Andrea: Through the process of creating, I begin to understand why I’m connected to these symbols. Why do I keep drawing tigers with flames coming out of their eyes and roaring? I’m pretty pissed off it turns out. It helps you channel those feelings while also examining them from the outside.
Marisa: You can separate yourself from thinking something like, “I feel like a vulnerable mom right now.” Well, I didn’t have the language for that at the time. I was too stressed out being a vulnerable mom. So I would make these masks of fangs and realize that’s how I feel out in the world. Sometimes it takes years to even process that, but having the visual really helps.
Sawa: What can you say to emerging artists?
Devon: There’s so many things that can be overwhelming. Finding your style, figuring out your marketing, going with a gallery, whatever. All that stuff will come into play and it’s often a game of who can last the longest, because it is difficult. It takes resources and time. You’ll probably have to supplement income somehow. And what helps you last is loving it. If you have the heart and the love for it, I think your job is to last as long as you can making art. The only way you’re gonna last is if you love it.
Sawa: How has your art-making been rewarding lately, especially as a tool to connect with the world?
Andrea: I made this painting, it’s a mama and a baby elephant and they’re sleeping in the grass. Someone messaged me and said they saw this painting and it made them cry because they were a new mom and it perfectly captured that feeling of vulnerability and protection that they were feeling as a mother. And I was like, “Holy shit. My intention was, elephants are cute.”
Marisa: It’s a connection over time and space. I’ve got people all over the world that have my stuff in their homes and some of it’s very silly and it says stuff like “farts” on it. They walk past it and they giggle and it’s like I’m connected to this person in that I make them laugh every day. We transcend time and space in that way.
Devon: The last thing I would add to that is the magic of connecting with yourself, right? Because you are the person that you’re gonna have the closest, most intimate relationship with over the course of your entire life. Through this long journey of chipping away the rocks, I can see this part of myself, and it’s the magic of me. It’s the magic of your own spirit or self coming through. I think that that’s what the practice really is for me.
Sawa: Art is a powerful means to connect with others as well as ourselves, but how does it guide us when the world feels like it’s closing in?
Andrea: My upcoming solo collection is called Oasis, and it’s a break. That’s the whole concept — I want peace, I want safety, I want a break. If you can’t imagine a safe and beautiful world and escape into the possibility of that, you can’t get through all the darkness. For me it’s super important to be aware, and to do what I can to fight the horrors that are mounting everyday, but also to have those little bits of peace and those little bits of safety that keep me going.
Sawa: Andrea, can you tell me more about these beautiful worlds?
Andrea: They’re like terrariums, these zoomed-in worlds that are kind of floating in space. I’m moving away from that a little bit and I’ve started working on more scenes. A lot of it has to do with animals and families. Especially the concept of abundance, of having everything you need. The way I started this series, they were all in skulls; these perfect little animal worlds which were very memento mori.
Marisa: Andrea creates these like idyllic scenes that make you look a lot deeper and you realize there’s linkages here. There’s a story being told here, in these tiny utopias.
Andrea: I love having little details, little secrets that are in everything that you can look at and find later.
Devon: It’s funny when you say that you hide things in there, little secrets, because the number one thing that came to mind when I thought of your work was little gems. When you take your paintings in as a whole, it’s a fantastical land I want to escape to, but there’s always something that pulls you in and makes you look deeper. And I think you’ve also really managed to create something that is so accessible, so beautiful, so well executed and yet deep and meaningful at the same time. And that’s not an easy balance to strike.
Sawa: It’s special to share so many different angles to each other’s work. Marisa, what are you working on?
Marisa: The unifying thread is identity, understanding myself and how I move throughout the world. I have a lot of animal avatars that represent facets of my personality. I do a lot of sculpture, because it feels potent to make with my hands, and it’s challenging. I create other two-dimensional art that I think is more pretty, but I make that for different reasons. It’s more calming for me.
The work itself is necessary for me. It’s not so much a career thing although it’s become a career, but it’s necessary for me to make art because I’ve gone long periods without making it and it just feels very wrong. I put the work into it to be a career, but when it comes down to it, making art is something I have to do because it’s a part of understanding myself. But a lot of it is also whimsy and fun. I always refer back to the things that have inspired me: bugs, animals, clay, animation, Pee-wee Herman, stuff like that.
Devon: I would describe so much of it as hidden in plain sight, because your work is very assertive, but you could be looking directly at it and almost miss that. I think part of that is maximalism and overstimulation. Marisa’s work is literally screaming, like literally. And even in the pieces where there’s no actual screams happening, a lot of it is masks and self-protection and how you are expressing yourself in the world. I don’t think that comes across when we meet you as a person, but it’s so vivid in your art. Clearly that is where you are channeling that.
Andrea: When you first meet Marisa you’re like, oh my god, she’s so cute. She’s so sweet. But when you talk to her, as sweet as she is, as beautiful as her heart is, she’s not a pushover. She will always speak her mind. She’s going to stand up for people that cannot have a voice for themselves and she’s gonna stand up for the people that she loves and cares about. Marisa is sweet, but she’s also very brave and…
Marisa: I’m a bitch.
Andrea: I mean, aren’t we all?
Marisa: Navigating this world as a woman, as a mother, as a parent of disabled kids, of having my own disabilities, you have to present yourself one way and behave another way. And this is a reflection of me. Motherhood is violent.
Sawa :It’s alchemical, transforming that violence into beauty. Devon, what’s your practice looking like these days?
Devon: I’m primarily a 2D artist. Right now my main medium is oil paint, but I’ve done a lot of mixed media with glitter, airbrushing, and acrylic in the past. I’m balancing the real and unreal in my work. At the same time, I’m very concerned with time. So I see things as happening now, but it’s also a revisiting of the past. It’s all very personal so I try to weave lightness and humor into it because that’s how I get through it, the little hidden pieces of irony that make me laugh.
Nostalgia is a big theme since I am working with the past. I am a child of the nineties and feel strong attachment to the early 2000s. So you’ll see a lot of pop culture references, toys, pink and purple were the colors of my bedroom growing up. There’s a lot of ghosts in my paintings, and that’s intentional because for whatever reason, I don’t want this world to feel like there’s a biology to it, or that it’s alive. It’s almost like remnants, or things left over. A memory. So they are the storytellers, and a sort of blank canvas for the experience.
I definitely incorporate a lot of chains, doors, locks and keys. I see keys as being maybe an answer to something. There’s a lot of imagery that might ask questions about whether we’re trapped, whether we’re making a choice. Are we stuck? Is it self-inflicted?
Marisa: I think you’re really good at revealing evidence of it having been a place once lived in. There’s no one there, but there’s all of these indications, and that leaves so many questions. That’s why your work is so compelling — it’s really haunted. I want to know why it’s haunted, and there’s all these clues.
Andrea: Your work for me, it’s like a haunted mall. You’re capturing exactly what it feels like to go back to memories that are always in your head. You perfectly capture what it feels like to be haunted by a memory.
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